property ownership profile

[pigro]

Originally Posted by giovanni

If Italy magazine was to do such a poll, i would be more than willing to give them a pretty complete rundown on my assets

Gio ... I can assure you that, if Italymag (or anyone else) asked me for "a pretty complete rundown on my assets" I'd tell them exactly where to go.

On the other hand, me asking you to indicate anonymously whether or not you own one or "more than one" property, without any indication of the value(s) or location(s) isn't really any such request.

Originally Posted by giovanni

but when a user of this site asks, i am troubled as to why?

(a) I've seen lots of conflicting stat's re. UK second home ownership, both in general and specific to Italy. When I looked online to find out the correct stats, I discovered that most of those stats are based upon airport surveys of small (<200) groups of travellers; therefore highly prone to error. I found (presumably) credible stats from the UK office of national Statistics which states that there were only 3000 second homes owned in Italy by UK residents in 2003/04. This surprised me (I'd expected more) and I thought this poll might give me another perspective.

(b) I hope to fund my future time in Italy via earnings from property investment; I'm curious how common a goal that is, and how many people are either already making it work or share the same intent.

Originally Posted by giovanni

This poll cannot give anywhere near an accuratte profile of members so leaves me suspect to its use.

Why can it not give an accurate profile? unless people lie, then the % of responses will correctly reflect the categories I included; Obviously the fewer who reply the less I can extrapolate the data into a meaningful trend - but that's a fact of life for any poll, and the results would in any case remain "accurate" as far as they go.

Anyway, I'm sorry if people feel this is too intrusive, and clearly it is for some. However, as I said before, if you are suspicious or worried about your privacy, it's very simple - just don't participate.

but please, have a little more faith in my motives animatedWinkLoop.gif

[Scrapspal]

Gio, stop being negative and just tick a ruddy box - any box. The only person that can see who has voted is the Admin and he's never around long enough anyway - must be too busy, but I doubt very much he is out robbing houses, especially yours or mine with all the security we have installed around us.

[giovanni]

Originally Posted by Scrapspal

Gio, stop being negative and just tick a ruddy box - any box. The only person that can see who has voted is the Admin and he's never around long enough anyway - must be too busy, but I doubt very much he is out robbing houses, especially yours or mine with all the security we have installed around us.

Last friday i was in venice [ i was so surprised at it beauty ] we decided
to have an ice cream, but the choice just had me changing my mind as
to which 3 flavours to have.

So in the end told my wife to pick for me..

So why don,t you pick which box i need to tick as the choice is to much
for me, but still i feel the need to participate....

[pigro]

here's a link to the Office of National Statistics data I mentioned if anyone is interested:

link to pdf file on second home ownership statistics measurment

[Transformer man]

Good thread Pigro.

The early results are not surprising in the way they pan out.

[giovanni]

Originally Posted by pigro

Gio ... I can assure you that, if Italymag (or anyone else) asked me for "a pretty complete rundown on my assets" I'd tell them exactly where to go.

On the other hand, me asking you to indicate anonymously whether or not you own one or "more than one" property, without any indication of the value(s) or location(s) isn't really any such request.



(a) I've seen lots of conflicting stat's re. UK second home ownership, both in general and specific to Italy. When I looked online to find out the correct stats, I discovered that most of those stats are based upon airport surveys of small (<200) groups of travellers; therefore highly prone to error. I found (presumably) credible stats from the UK office of national Statistics which states that there were only 3000 second homes owned in Italy by UK residents in 2003/04. This surprised me (I'd expected more) and I thought this poll might give me another perspective.

(b) I hope to fund my future time in Italy via earnings from property investment; I'm curious how common a goal that is, and how many people are either already making it work or share the same intent.



Why can it not give an accurate profile? unless people lie, then the % of responses will correctly reflect the categories I included; Obviously the fewer who reply the less I can extrapolate the data into a meaningful trend - but that's a fact of life for any poll, and the results would in any case remain "accurate" as far as they go.

Anyway, I'm sorry if people feel this is too intrusive, and clearly it is for some. However, as I said before, if you are suspicious or worried about your privacy, it's very simple - just don't participate.

but please, have a little more faith in my motives Attachment 1728

OK, i accept your motives are well meaning, but what i said earlier holds true
even more so now that you have explained your motive.

Firstly you well have far to few a response to get anysort of accurate picture.

[This forum does not have enough regulars for you to do so]

secondly. you have grouped everything into a large pie that is ITALY, you
have no regions to see where the potential investment would be better
served.

Lastly my objection was not enterly aimed at what you wanted from this
poll, but the fact the info was available to everyone and being as you do
not know me from adam, [this also applies to everyone] maybe some
third party could have thought to try to benefit from it.

No i am not surprised that there seems to be only 3000 uk residents with
officially properties in Italy.

[pigro]

Gio, most of your last comments don't need answered - the answers are obvious and I'll not waste further time trying to convince you.

However please note that I don't care "where the investment is better served" as that's not at all the point of the poll. The investment that I'm referring to is in property that's likely to be in the respondant's "home country" (i.e. not Italy for most people here) and in my case it was all acquired long, long ago based upon careful personal research at that time.

I wouldn't trust an internet poll to tell me what/where I should be buying if it was baked beans far less property, but I would trust it to tell me how many others were employing a similar general approach.

Maybe this poll is hard for you to participate in because you are (I assume) Italian by birth and therefore don't fit into any category? If so, sorry, but it's my poll after all - why not go and design one you like better instead of wasting your time picking holes in mine

[giovanni]

Originally Posted by pigro

Gio, most of your last comments don't need answered - the answers are obvious and I'll not waste further time trying to convince you.

However please note that I don't care "where the investment is better served" as that's not at all the point of the poll. The investment that I'm referring to is in property that's likely to be in the respondant's "home country" (i.e. not Italy for most people here) and in my case it was all acquired long, long ago based upon careful personal research at that time.

I wouldn't trust an internet poll to tell me what/where I should be buying if it was baked beans far less property, but I would trust it to tell me how many others were employing a similar general approach.

Maybe this poll is hard for you to participate in because you are (I assume) Italian by birth and therefore don't fit into any category? If so, sorry, but it's my poll after all - why not go and design one you like better instead of wasting your time picking holes in mine

It seems you are taking offence to some of my pionts, sorry cannot help that

But i believe it is safe to say you do not have a background in statistics.
[if you do, then you seem to have forgotten the basics]

One should always check and get as much background infi as possible,again
you seem to have failed there too as my id would have told you, you are
incorrect in you assumption that i am just Italian.

Now clearly again you have forgotten what you wrote in your first post,
otherwise you would remember that you did indeed write about the
possibility of offending people with this poll, but now you seem offended by
the fact i may fall into that catogory,and now you take offence to my
response.!

Even if it looks like i am picking an argument, it is not the case i mearly
tried to piont out a few things concerning the polls accuracy and relevent
use as statistics [something i did know about in an earlier life] so therefore
for once find it relevent to reply.

If you do not like my replies clearly you can just ignore them.

Like i said not looking for an arguement, but facts was my line of work,and
i did well at it....

regards gio... lorry driver sounds good.

[pigro]

1. don't worry, I'm not offended at all

2. I'm not a statistician, but I'm competent in the basics thanks. I've already covered the risk of extrapolation based on statistically insignificant sample data & I wouldn't base any significant decisions or actions upon such extrapolation. This however isn't such a scenario, so relax.

3. I didn't need to do a background check on you because my sentence began with "maybe", contained "assume" and ended with a "?". Quicker to ask than look at your public profile (if thats what you meant by your "id").

4. As it happens I did look at your profile before posting (cos I'm a curious old soul) but it doesn't actually give any explicit info on your nationality. It does confirm you have multiple locations, and I suppose could infer from the order in which you list them that you may not be Italian ... but that is an inference; any good statistician would tell you that you should ask a question rather than try to make an assumption based on incomplete and ambiguous internet data

4. I haven't forgotten what I wrote in my first post, and neither it or any other post by me mentions "offending" people as far as I know - please quote me if you know different. If you mean my statement "I'm sorry if people feel this is too intrusive" ... then I guess you do seem to fall into that category, but don't worry, I'm STILL not offended at all, just starting to realise how much time it's taking to keep addressing your increasingly tenuous points ... but its a free world, so keep 'em coming and I'll start to ignore you when they reach a sufficient level of triviality.

5. and I'm still not offended

[giovanni]

Originally Posted by pigro

1. don't worry, I'm not offended at all

2. I'm not a statistician, but I'm competent in the basics thanks. I've already covered the risk of extrapolation based on statistically insignificant sample data & I wouldn't base any significant decisions or actions upon such extrapolation. This however isn't such a scenario, so relax.

3. I didn't need to do a background check on you because my sentence began with "maybe", contained "assume" and ended with a "?". Quicker to ask than look at your public profile (if thats what you meant by your "id").

4. As it happens I did look at your profile before posting (cos I'm a curious old soul) but it doesn't actually give any explicit info on your nationality. It does confirm you have multiple locations, and I suppose could infer from the order in which you list them that you may not be Italian ... but that is an inference; any good statistician would tell you that you should ask a question rather than try to make an assumption based on incomplete and ambiguous internet data

4. I haven't forgotten what I wrote in my first post, and neither it or any other post by me mentions "offending" people as far as I know - please quote me if you know different. If you mean my statement "I'm sorry if people feel this is too intrusive" ... then I guess you do seem to fall into that category, but don't worry, I'm STILL not offended at all, just starting to realise how much time it's taking to keep addressing your increasingly tenuous points ... but its a free world, so keep 'em coming and I'll start to ignore you when they reach a sufficient level of triviality.

5. and I'm still not offended

I am glad you are not offended, lifes too short, but i now found myself
eagerly looking at the poll to see how it develops.

ATM we have 5 residential owners/investment! this is the largest group so
far, now i am hoping you will explain this to me or maybe one of the 5 could
do it for me.

You see to my way of thinking there is alway a positive and minus,it therefore
stand to reason does it not that you should have a group for the residential
owners/investment loss?

In otherwords who on earth buys ANY property at all as there "sole property"
to see their investment go down?

Infact i will go one futher how can it be an investment if its your sole
property?
You either bought the property because you would like to live there [italy]
it is therefore part of your assets, but property lived in cannot surely be
classied as an investment in the same way as a 2nd or 3rd property because
if you release that capital you still need to spend some,all or even more to
buy somewhere else.or am i wrong?

If indeed they are investments,then am i to assume that Italian property has
been out performing the uk market in the last 5 years?

Sorry but i do like facts and statistics...