Berlusconi lives...!

[Nardini]

Originally Posted by deborahandricky

Do you mean these guys ????

If it wasn't for the fact that several of these people have been found guilty of serious criminal offences, that would have been quite amusing.

Originally Posted by deborahandricky

Below is the list of names of Italian representatives in the Italian and European Parliaments that have been convicted of a crime:

Berruti Massimo Maria (Member of Parliament Forza Italia) Driving with due care and attention

8 months for favouring in a trial for bribes to Guardia di Finanza

Originally Posted by deborahandricky

Biondi Alfredo (Member of Parliament Forza Italia) Wearing Gucci knockoffs

Actually a Senator for Liguria - 2 months (negotiated) tax fraud in Genova.

Originally Posted by deborahandricky

Bonsignore Vito (Udc - Member of European Parliament) Not using his mobile whilst driving

2 years for attempted corruption in the construction of a hospital in Asti.

Originally Posted by deborahandricky

Borghezio Mario (Lega Nord - Member of European Parliament) Making a pass at an older woman

(1) Fined 750.000 lire for beating a Moroccan child in 1993.

(2) Fined 3.040 Euros in 2005 for arson of the belongings of some immigrants sleeping under a bridge.

Originally Posted by deborahandricky

Bossi Umberto (Lega Nord - Member of European Parliament) Not having suger in his coffee

8 months for the Enimont bribe.

Originally Posted by deborahandricky

Cantoni Giampiero (Member of Parliament Forza Italia) Seen entering a starbucks

As former president of Banca Nazionale del Lavoro, associated to the Italian Socialist Party, he was investigated and arrested for corruption, bankruptcy fraud and other crimes. He negotiated sentences for about two years, and refunded 800 millions lire.

Originally Posted by deborahandricky

Carra Enzo (Member of Parliament Ulivo) Seen in public with a woman that was his wife

1 year and 4 months in prison for false statements to prosecutors about the Enimont bribe.

Originally Posted by deborahandricky

Cirino Pomicino Paolo (Member of Parliament Democrazia Cristiana - Partito Socialista) Seen in restaurant not watching the television

1 year and 8 months for illegal financing, in the Enimont bribe

2 months negotiated for corruption and Eni black funds.

Originally Posted by deborahandricky

De Angelis Marcello (Member of Parliament Alleanza Nazionale) Not being seen in Hello for 2 issues

Actually a Senator for Abruzzo since 28 April 2006 - and not on the list.

Originally Posted by deborahandricky

D'Elia Sergio (Member of Parliament Rosa nel Pugno) Not wearing brown shoes with a blue suit

Not on the list

Originally Posted by deborahandricky

Dell'Utri Marcello (Member of Parliament Forza Italia) For not employing his family as advisers

2 years for tax fraud and false invoices in Turin, regarding his time in Publitalia.

6 months negotiated in Milan for other issues about false invoices accounting in Publitalia.

Originally Posted by deborahandricky

Del Pennino Antonio (Member of Parliament Forza Italia) Paying the correct amount of IVA

Actually a Senator for Milano since 12 July 2006.
2 months and 20 days negotiated for illegal financing (Enimont bribe)

1 year, 8 months and 20 days negotiated for illegal financing in the Milan underground.

Originally Posted by deborahandricky

De Michelis Gianni (Nuovo Psi - Member of European Parliament) For asking for butter with his bread

Resigned his seat in Tuscany back in 28 April 2006 after just 7 days in the Camera dei Deputati.

1 year and 6 months negotiated in Milan for corruption and bribes for highways in Veneto

6 months negotiated for illegal financing (Enimont bribe).

Originally Posted by deborahandricky

And lets not forget the ex Boss himself ….Being in possession of a dodgy hair transplant

Notwithstanding Berlusconi himself, deserving of a book all to himself (try Sack of Rome!) you (or rather the site you copied and pasted from) missed a few...

Walter De Rigo (senator for Forza Italia)

• 1 year and 4 months negotiated for fraud on the ministry of Work and the European Economic Community for 474 millions lire, in exchange for fake professional qualification courses for his firm.

Gianstefano Frigerio (MP for Forza Italia)

• 3 years and 9 months for corruption in Milan, dumping ground bribes;
• 2 years and 11 months for other two issues in Tangentopoli, among which corruption (both corruzione and concussione variants of the Italian legal system), receiving stolen goods and illegal financing.

Giorgio Galvagno (MP for Forza Italia), former socialist mayor of Asti

• 6 months and 26 days negotiated in 1996 for pollution of acquifer, abuse and omission of due acts in office, false statement, nonintentional crimes against public health (pollution of aquifer) and omitted reporting for the responsibles of the Asti corruption situation in the Vallemanina and Valleandona dumping ground scandal (unlawful waste disposal of toxic waste, in exchange for bribes).

Lino Jannuzzi (senator for Forza Italia)

• 2 years and 4 months for various slander, was graced by the President of the Republic just before being jailed. [1]

Giorgio La Malfa (MP for Italian Republican Party, minister for Community Policies)

• 6 months and 20 days for illegal financing (Enimont bribe).

Roberto Maroni (MP for Lega Nord and minister of Work)

• 4 months and 20 days for resistance against public official during the police raid in the party's building in via Bellerio in Milan.

Augusto Rollandin (senator for Valdotanian Union-Democrats of the Left), former president of the regional council of the Aosta Valley

• 16 months and fined 2 millions lire in 1994, plus damages to be paid to the Region for abuse in office: he favoured a friend's firm in the assignment of a construction contract for a waste packer in Brissogne. After being removed from his position by the court of Turin, because he was "ineligible", in 2001 he became a candidate for the Valdotanian Union and the DS.

Vittorio Sgarbi (MP for Forza Italia)

• 6 months for grand and continued fraud against the state, i.e. the minister of Culture.

Calogero Sodano (senator for UDC), formerly mayor of Agrigento

• 1 year and 6 months for abuse in office aiming to favour illegal construction firms in exchange for voting favours.

Egidio Sterpa (MP for Forza Italia)

• 6 months for the Enimont bribe.

Antonio Tomassini (senator for Forza Italia), surgeon

• 3 years for false statements: during a birth, a baby was born with brain damage. Forza Italia designated him responsible for health in the party and president of the Work Health commission in the Senate.

Vincenzo Visco (MP for Democrats of the Left)

• 10 days and 20 million lire in fine for construction abuse in 2001, because of some illegal works in his house in Pantelleria. He was also ordered to "restore the locations", i.e. demolishing the abusive constructions.

Alfredo Vito (MP for Forza Italia)

• 2 years negotiated and 5 billion lire repaid for 22 counts of corruption in Naples.

The best place for jokes is in the Friday Joke thread - especially in the political situation Italy finds itself in at the moment, wouldn't you say?

Ciao.

[deborahandricky]

Which way to the naughty corner ...............

[Nardini]

Originally Posted by deborahandricky

Which way to the naughty corner ...............

Here...

[pigro]

I grazied D&R's post because it was hilarious. I take Nardini's point that he's raised a very serious subject, in a political part of the forum, & it's not one which should be trivialised.

However, I don't think D&R's input neccessarily did so (trivialised matters, that is). It is in fact wickedly satirical of the egomania/pomp of Italian politicians, which itself is IMO a telling symptom of their corrupt tendencies: think Jonathan Aitken speechifying on TV about wielding the sword of truth (or whatever tosh he cobbled together) ... ego often provides a convenient smokescreen for an underlying malaise. Satire has long been a tool of political commentary, and often the most effective tool for making joe public actually sit up & take some notice. in some societies, its also the only way to get a dissident viewpoint out "under the radar" of the authorities.

So, just wanted to say that I don't find D&R's joke to be out of place in the thread ... and, had it not been there, I wouldn't have had the opportunity to read Nardini's excellent rebuttal, which really opened my eyes and brought the thread to life ... "beating a moroccan child" ... FFS.

[AllanMason]

Originally Posted by numerouno

Imagine working for an organisation that has just over 600 employees, of which:

[A cut 'n' paste list of BS that doesn't deserve repeating.]

Which organisation is this? Its neither owned nor run by Berlusconi......

It's the House of Commons, whose 635 members are the same group that cranks out hundreds of new laws each year designed to keep the rest of us in line, and they want a pay rise!

Nonsense like this annoys me.

The most trivial error in the post is that there are currently 646 MPs in the House of Commons, not 635.

More seriously, the list of crimes is total rubbish. Everyone who helps spread ill-founded assertions like this contributes to the corrosive atmosphere of cynicism about politics and politicians created by the media these days. It's all too easy to say, "Huh! All politicians are crooks!" shrug and absolve oneself from even the minimal responsibility we have in democratic countries of making a choice at election time, nevermind actually getting involved in politics and trying to make things better.

It is, as Nardini's carefully researched post indicates, not at all difficult to find politicians in Italy who have close personal experience of the law at both ends of the process. It's also certainly the case that Members of Parliament in the UK are human beings, not saints. However, a few minutes Googling for information on the list of crimes cited by numerouno will lead you to this BBC page or to that fount of truth in a forest of urban myths and lies, Snopes, where you will find that the statistics have nothing whatsoever to do with the House of Commons. The list of nefarious activities was originally supposed to prove how crooked members of the US Congress are. However, even though it's possible there is some basis of truth in the numbers and crimes listed, it is impossible to verify this since the original source was careful not to name names. What's more, it's an interesting question how the original source could have gathered their information. How, for example, could they know that American Express (to cite the credit card company mentioned in the original piece) had refused anyone a card? And of course, given what the USA is like, it would be surprising if any group of a few hundred people didn't include quite a few who had been sued for something or other at some time.

In short, the list was purest BS when used against member of the US Congress and totally irrelevant in considering whether British MPs are fit to hold their jobs.

Be cynical about politics and politicians if that allows you to feel superior to them, but it's a wise person who knows it's far too easy to believe that Tony Blair, Nelson Mandela, Berlusconi and Robert Mugabe are all the same and all motivated by the same thing.

Al

[deborahandricky]

[quote=pigro;81676]QUOTE]

I still think your sexists


Isle of man indeed


Just off now to find some comfy shoes amd a pipe
Love Deborah and Mary

[deborahandricky]

What’s the difference between the UK, Italian, US, German governments and the London , Milan, NY , Berlin , symphony string section ……………









There all on the fiddle…………………………………….

[pigro]

Originally Posted by deborahandricky

I still think your sexists


Isle of man indeed


Just off now to find some comfy shoes amd a pipe
Love Deborah and Mary

To be accused of being a sexist is bad enough ... to be accused of being a whole gang of them is worse & not at all good for my schizo tendencies!

Just changed my sig ... so you can smoke your pipe in peace. Just don't fug up the naughty corner too much with smoke. Sorry Nardini, its all D&R's fault, I'm not trying to derail your thread again :-)

[Nardini]

... is no longer Silvio Berlusconi, probable future prime minister of Italy!

He has dropped back to third place in the new Forbes list of Italian "richest people" - a mere number 90 in the world at large.

Third place? Good grief! How has he managed to fall behind both Michele Ferrero & family and also Leonardo Del Vecchio ? Not by stint of good management it would seem.

I'm quite happy to keep buying Ferrero Rocher choccies and wearing my Ray Bans now!

[giovanni]

Theres a fair few young russians on that list, well they have to be young,the walls only been down 17odd years...