How to deal with dubious estate agents in the forum

[ram]

I stand corrected - my experience here in Sicily told me that it would be impossible to be a libero professionista without being registered at the CCIAA - in fact they collocate Partita IVA with having a trade and therefore needing to be in one albo or another. All down to an interpretation of the rules perhaps?
Being an estate agent requires inscription in an albo more because it is in incompatible profession with many others - and they want to know if you are doubling up. You cant be inscribed as a geometra and be an estate agent at the same time for instance, nor a public dependent nor an architect or lawyer - though it doesnt seem to stop many from doing so.

[gardahomes]

Originally Posted by ram

my experience here in Sicily told me that it would be impossible to be a libero professionista without being registered at the CCIAA - in fact they collocate Partita IVA with having a trade and therefore needing to be in one albo or another. All down to an interpretation of the rules perhaps?

ah-ha - that's because as an estate agent you are not allowed to be a libera professionista/lavoratore autonomo - you HAVE to register as a ditta individuale (or a company if you prefer, just not a libera professionista) because they consider estate agent work to be work of an "impresa" (be it individual or non), NOT a "libero professione" like a consultant, translator, lawyer or notary (I've lumped those four together because they are all libero professioni, but the first two don't have mandatory albi/ordini whereas the second two do). So a "freelance" estate agent HAS to register with the camcom, and you, as estate agent have to be "Immobiliare Italia di Giovanni Rossi", and not just Giovanni Rossi. Whereas as a libera professionista you would invoice simply as Giovanni Rossi plus partita IVA (like my notary, for example, or a freelance translator). Libero professioniste have nothing to do with the camera di commercio UNLESS there is an official albo, and the albo is kept at the camcom. So no, I don't think it's a question of interpreting the rules, it's just the difference between a being registered as a ditta individuale (obligation to register with the camcom) versus libera professionista (no such obligation, unless there is a requirement to register with a ruolo, albo or register that is held at the camcom). Also some professions/trades have incompatibility rules and some don't. Usually (but not always) the ones with albos or ruolos do (like a lawyer or estate agent), and the ones without don't as they are essentially unregulated.

I will go away now

[Liset]

Hi,
I'm relatively new here in this forum, but working as a freelance translator I believe gardahomes is right.
There is no official accreditation system, but several translation/interpreting associations are working hard for som kind of official recognition (here I can think of AITI, ANITI, ASSOINTERPRETI). We are highly taxed and have practically no fiscal privileges.
Lately the existing albo's (commercialisti etc.) have been opposing to the recognition of the new professions, as they are afraid of having their own privileges "watered out" by this proces.

It is true that in Italy anyone can asseverare a translation in Tribunale, just not the directly interested party. Most laywers, however, require that you are a CTU member. The procedure for being registered with your Tribunale varies from region to region so you always have to ask. F.ex. here in Pescara they only required that I was on the CCIAA's list of translators/interpreters, to become that, I just had to deliver a CV and pay a 100 euro fee, and then I had to take an English test (they didn't question my Danish...), but I know that f.ex. in Rome things are not that simple. I have never been called for any jobs, it is mainly an image-thing and it is absolutely no problem working without.

AITI used to have a public tariffario, but were told to remove it by the Garante. Most translators don't believe in an albo, the problem would be the accreditation.
And then, personally I needed some paperwork done for the italian embassy in my home country which required a danish-italian accredited translator (that means a MBa from the Copenhagen Business School). It turned out that anybody could have done the job better than this person..so how do you ensure that your accreditation system works?

A lot of Italian clients only look at price, as in most professions it's the same with translation: you get what you pay for. This is also why "passaparola" still works so well here.

Ciao
Liset, Abruzzo

[Gala Placidia]

A proper accreditation system, run by an official body which is recognised by government and fostered by relevant authorities would eliminate many of the problems, but not all. Consumer education is an area which has to be tackled, not only for the protection of professional practitioners who are fully accredited but also for the good of the users of those services.
Professional indemnity assurance to cover practitioners is also vital, particularly for those dealing with legal translating and interpreting.
There are nowadays university courses where you can graduate as an interpreter or translator. In my times, usually you had to have a degree in the target language, preferably some experience which was difficult to get and sit for accreditation examinations which were one-way into the target language and which were quite "painful". There were also examinations in two languages at lower level, not professional translating and interpreting but what was called "language aide". These were also difficult and the rate of success was quite low at all levels, in my times they were around 20%.
Most of the users of translating and interpreting services are totally unaware about the wide differences that can exist between a proper professional translating or interpreting job and an unqualified one. They also ignore the dangers that can exist in certain cases.
I worked in the profession many years ago and I even had to create an agency for fellow professionals as clients got used to my services and they had difficulties understanding that I could only function in certain languages. So I had to set up a business and get a team together and we happily worked together until I decided that I had done enough and that I wanted to enjoy life.
What Liset says about "passaparola" is right. The problem is that you can be inundated with work as it was my case in the past and it can become quite exhausting. Also, if you get involved with providing services to the Police and Justice Department you risk being called at 4:00 am because they have aprehended somebody who cannot speak the language..... I has happened to me..... This is why I opted for early retirement.